Angela Hurt founded Veracity, a technology and management consulting company in 2006. She now has about 150 team members. Angela oversees the strategic direction of the company, which delivers IT solutions to its customers in the commercial and government sectors. She's a long time athlete in numerous sports and she's been on numerous boards, a mentor and extremely involved in the Kansas City community. Joel sat down with Angela to talk leadership, culture, women in technology and sports.

---

Joel Goldberg:
Welcome into Rounding The Bases, a special thanks as always to AY for the intro. You can Google him, AY MusiK to check him out.

My guest this episode is one of those people that I knew I had to meet because I was being told over and over again, "You've got to connect with Angela Hurt." And when enough people that I respect tell me, "Go meet this person." I know it's going to be a very meaningful and positive conversation. That's exactly what happened. Angela is the founder and CEO of Veracity, phenomenal leader, extremely involved in the community. Let's get right to the conversation with Angela Hurt. Angela, thanks so much for joining the podcast. I've got a lot I want to ask you about just because you're doing so many great things here at Veracity and so many people are involved with it and I know this is a place that people enjoy working. It's a cool place by the way too, a really great setup, but nutshell here, give everyone an idea of what you all do at Veracity.

Angela Hurt:
So we're a technology consulting company, also management consulting and essentially we are trusted advisors that our clients lean on to bring innovative thought process within their organization of how they may deliver and support their business through technology investments.

Angela Hurt - Being Problem Solvers and Truth Tellers in the Community

Joel Goldberg:
I know that I was looking on your LinkedIn page and in the description it's talked about problem solvers and truth tellers in the community. Can you expand on that a little bit more?

Angela Hurt:
Sure. So I think that one of the really unique and cool things about Veracity is when you talk about problem solving, we describe the type of resources and talent that we have, and they're not your traditional IT project manager developer, that that we truly hire people that have curious minds. Curiosity is a big part of our ... If you look around, our whiteboards all have our values, which includes curiosity. And when you have a natural curiosity, you become a problem solver. So we're not here helping solve simple problems for our clients. They're complex that require the ability to ask really good questions. On the flip side of that, when you're problem solving, truth tellers comes in, and again the name of our company being Veracity, the integrity and the ability to say it like it is, is sometimes not the popular answer for our clients, but when we are going through that problem solving solution, being a truth teller and and giving that to them straight of where things need to go is something that's extremely important, and I know very much valued by our clients.

Joel Goldberg:
So I want to focus a little more on the curiosity aspect of it. I think it's one of the most important traits that that anyone can have. When you're hiring, and you have, if I remember correctly, around 150 employees, is that right?

Angela Hurt:
Yeah, 150 team members, yeah.

What Veracity looks for in it's team members

Joel Goldberg:
Okay. Team members here in Kansas city and beyond and in other locations too. Are you searching for that curiosity, for that trait in someone, or is that something that you're coaching?

Angela Hurt:
That's a tough question. I think that our talent team, our recruiting and HR team understands as it being part of our overall values as an organization of curiosity that I think that as we discuss those things that we have some behavioral questions to kind of understand whether or not somebody's curious. We're also fortunate in a lot of the talent that we get comes with being curious because they are real nerds about technology. So that kind of comes with an extent of always learning, and it's always been curious about what's coming next. So it's partly we ... I know when it's somebody I'm hiring for a specific role that's going to report to me it is absolutely important. And then by nature, by what some folks are doing, it's cultivated.

Joel Goldberg:
So you founded Veracity in 2006, right?

Angela Hurt:
Yeah.

Joe Goldberg:
How much has it evolved? How much has it changed in these last 13, 14 years?

Angela Hurt:
So what's really cool is we had a meeting last week of kind of looking at our year end for 2019 and then where we're going in 2020, and we were talking about a lot of work that we're doing to kind of building our foundation. And by foundation, I really mean the processes and back office workflows and policy. The stuff that you don't do when you're a startup because you're constantly changing. And I loved it because one of our longterm employees of 10 years said that one of the things that she most values about our organization is that we have never strayed from our value set in our foundation. So she and I were talking about very different things. She's talking about the foundational values of the organization. I'm talking about the foundation of a house that we're building here.

Angela Hurt on taking Veracity 100% Virtual

Angela Hurt:
But the message, if you listen to a podcast from years ago, and I'm talking 2011, you'll hear our message is very much the same. We have not strayed from who we are. What we've strayed from and what has changed and evolved is our no bricks and mortar, like we're going to be 100% virtual. Which, as we've grown, I've found that while we can still have some real elements of teleworking and being where you need to be to get your job done, we have found that we needed to get a traditional space for our people to come together and them feel that culture that we have created. The other things that changes, that has to continue to change our service offerings. So while we still have our foundational service offerings that we have, in technology, you have to change with the changing market, and people will often ask how you keep up and it's like you have no choice. And so that's the only area that you would truly see from a change in who we are, or just some of those pieces because our clients are needing different things.

Joel Goldberg:
No, that resonates. And I compare a lot back to baseball and sports, which I know you, and you're an athlete, so you can certainly relate to that too. But the world's changing. You've got to keep up with the world. I mean, take it in baseball terms, the technology that's offered to the player now some people will say it's too much or this or that. It's not like the old days, is it paralysis by analysis? I mean, you've got to figure out what works for you, what hasn't changed for the Royals, and it sounds the same for Veracity, is that that foundation part that you talked about in terms of actually building that structure, who you are. They haven't changed who they are. Yes, they've evolved and they've learned, but their values are the same. And it sounds like that's been the case here. So what are the values that matter most to you as the founder and CEO of this company?

Angela Hurt:
So I think I've already mentioned curiosity. Flexibility for us is huge and people will ask us like, "Why do people want to do business with Veracity?" It's that problem solving and the curiosity, the truth telling. But flexibility is huge. It's one of our primary values. And, and that means we're flexible in how we approach things with you. Integrity is important to us as we go out and be in the community of who we are. So those are the things that have never strayed. Veracity is by nature is the propensity to tell the truth. And simply doing the right thing is another one of our values. As we talk to people, it even becomes down to decision making or how you approach problems within our organization. I'll have people come to me and say, "This is what happened. What do you think I should do?" And usually my response and reaction is, "Well, what do you think the right thing is to do? I want you to do the right thing." And it's a huge premise on how we operate as an organization.

Joel Goldberg:
And how much of that too is letting them make that decision?

Angela Hurt:
Right. Yeah. My hope is that they've watched, because my idea of doing the right thing is not always other people's idea of doing the right thing. And my idea of doing the right thing always comes down to a human element. It rarely is going to come down to ... I don't think anybody's going to make a decision of doing the right thing that's going to bankrupt the company, right? So I always hope that our leadership team values people in the same way that I do.

Age diversity within the team at Veracity

Joel Goldberg:
It's interesting. A couple of times that I've been in today, and you and I visited in December here at your office, which really is just a super cool ... It's got a great vibe to it. I mean, all these little ... We're in one of the kind of conference rooms right now, and it's got a nice feel and I'm sure that was by design, of a place that people want to hang out and work. But what's interesting to me is I look at it, and I'm seeing a very small snapshot is I see a wide range of ages here. I mean, everything from 20 somethings all the way up to some boomers and everything in between. And again, I'm just seeing a handful of people, but I'm wondering if that is by design or maybe beyond that, my question would be how have you figured out, because this is a struggle for some, ways to make all that work multi-generational, which is not an easy thing to do because we are all seeing things differently?

Angela Hurt:
Yeah. That's a really interesting question of how we make it work, and I don't know how intentional I've been about it versus just hiring people that we like to be around. But you're right. I mean, our oldest person on our team is 72 years old and is still here because he is passionate and loves what he does. Used to be a boss of mine. He would say that he's not a boss of mine, or that he wasn't, but he was. And we do, we have him and we've got a new graduate from KU and a lot of our folks who you're not seeing because they're in the field actually helping our clients be successful. As a consulting firm, we're not the big five where we bring people right out of college, train them up for three weeks and put them on client site.

Angela Hurt:
So one of the things we always talk about is that we sell experience, and with the experience is 15 to 20 years a minimum of kind of that trade. And only recently have you started seeing younger individuals in our organization because the world is changing and we've got a lot of training going on and what is really, really cool is that I'm seeing some of our boomers, as you said, working with our younger people in a way that I see them relating to them actually better than the age gap between, if that makes sense.

Joel Goldberg:
Yeah, sure.

Angela Hurt:
And it is so cool to watch. Of course, I can envision that they're talking to their daughter versus their coworker, and they're truly ... Like the way that they're mentoring and teaching has been really fun to watch. And again, we hire people, we'll test people out, we have them meet a lot of people and we hire a lot around personalities. People know what we stand for before they come in. And we also sell that we like to have fun. I know a lot of people love the whole work hard, play hard. I think we take it to extremes and people know what they're in for and we respect one another.

Joel Goldberg:
And do you see then that mutual respect going on from the boomer and the millennial? Because I've always thought why can't ... Now the second that we as an ... You and I are boomers but, but we certainly are every bit gen X and that's a completely different world than millennials. And I've never understood why anyone that's older would just discount them because they're younger. I like to be able to learn from people that are younger. At the same time, my experiences is that when that younger generation person feels like their opinion matters, they then want to learn from me. And there's great synergy there. Again, easier said than done. But is that what you're seeing?

Angela Hurt:
Absolutely. So it's really been fun because as we are a technology company, meaning we help our clients provide technology to their organizations. That doesn't mean that when you're in our operations team that everybody here is technical, right? And so one of the things that has been so exciting, we just had a meeting this morning and our new graduate and new hire is the one that runs our technology and those things and it is amazing.

Angela Hurt:
We've used this same tool for five years and I've seen us come so far in the last three months because of the things that she's done within the tool and watching our boomers and people like me just say, "Hey McKinnon, can you take care of this?" And she just does it. And the flip side, the amount of things that she is learning is huge. And I see it go both ways. It's like, "Hey, can you show me how you did that?" And then it in turn it is, she wants to soak up all the information from them. And it goes throughout our organization that we have some people who have tremendous amount of experience that they want that to live on as well. So it's cool to watch that happen.

Joel Goldberg:
It's one of the elements I talk about in my speeches in terms of culture is it's not just enough to build and sustain that culture. You've got to pass it on. It's certainly something that you pay attention to, you know that here at Veracity, every single day. But when that 72 year old can pass on what the culture is, what the beliefs are here, not just in telling it to that younger 22 year old, but showing it and then in turn be able to learn from her and on and on, that's going to set Veracity up as long as you guys stay true to who you are, which you have for so many years, for generations potentially. And that's got to feel really good as a leader to see what you've built, and now to watch it just being passed on.

Angela Hurt:
Yeah, it is. And along with the culture and everything else, that the amount of intellectual property, of, again, it kind of going back to our foundations of where that store that has passed on, but it really takes a concerted effort, also by these folks of passing it around, and watching them do that and want to ... I mean, Rod's, I think that what's happening with Veracity is as much of what I think Rod will see as part of his legacy is as I do. And I think it's huge that we have people in our organization who feels such passion and ownership and pride and they want it to continue on as well.

Angela Hurt discusses her leadership journey

Joel Goldberg:
One more leadership question about you and Veracity. When you started this in 2006, how many employees of your ... Up to around 150 people, team members, now, and how have you evolved as a leader in the last 13 years?

Angela Hurt:
Oh, so much. I mean, when I started veracity, I was a salesperson. I was a business developer. My leadership, and I know you and I talked about this briefly and I've talked about this before, but all of my leadership experience came from sports and being a team captain, or being a coach, a player coach, all of those things. What has happened since then, that that has been a great foundation for me and a building block. But it wasn't enough.

Angela Hurt:
So leadership skills have drastically changed from not only a business owner to the primary salesperson to becoming a true CEO, and then how do I build my leadership team around me has been the biggest challenge, and also I'm a big source of pride for me, but it's taken mentors that I've worked with outside of the company. I've had people who are within the company who have been my mentor. I had a old COO one time that would stop and say, "Hey, can we have a coaching moment?" And it was him coaching me, not the other way around. So I've had tremendous amount of growth and recently started working with a phenomenal executive coach to kind of even help me further that along as we grow.

Joel Goldberg:
And how many, when you started in 2006?

Angela Hurt:
I mean, me. I was the salesperson, recruiter, accountant, you name it.

Joel Goldberg:
Yeah.

Angela Hurt:
All of that good stuff.

Joel Goldberg:
Yep. Yeah.

Angela Hurt:
HR.

Joel Goldberg:
Now look at it.

Angela Hurt:
Yeah, that's pretty great

Baseball Themed Questions from Joel Goldberg

Joel Goldberg:
Time for the baseball themed questions. First one, what's the biggest home run that you have hit with Veracity or professionally?

Angela Hurt:
I think that ... I think probably the biggest hit has been around hiring a couple of very key employees. So we're a people based business. We don't have product, we don't have software, and hiring the right person who can elevate you. That happened probably about five years ago of somebody that we just kind of needed in that moment. So that was a very huge win for us. So I mean, that that's where it is. It's finding the right person that can actually help elevate from a leadership standpoint.

Joel Goldberg:
That makes sense too, right? I mean, and that might not be the home run that everybody thinks about, but without the right people ...

Angela Hurt:
Yeah. I'm a firm believer of hiring people smarter than you and more experienced than you, so you can learn from them. People who can buy into your vision. They buy into your vision and have the skill set of a large company. I mean, that's ... It's huge for us.

Angela Hurt's Swing and Miss

Joel Goldberg:
Second question, which is the swing and miss. What's the biggest swing and miss you've taken? What did you learn from it?

Angela Hurt:
So I'm probably not a shocker with being a people person. My biggest swing and misses have been wrong hires. And I don't want to say bad hires because they've been great people with great past performances and great skillsets, but wrong for our organization of our size. And it's a costly mistake when you do that. And I think the learning from it is taking longer time to, to hire folks. It is ... We're such a referral. We get people referred to us so often that it's really easy to know somebody in the community and know their reputation and say, "I'm going to hire this person." Without doing the traditional due diligence that you would do if you were hiring just anybody off the streets. And those ... I think it's a big lesson for everybody because it's so often things that we do. It's kind of the easy way out.

Small Ball Question

Joel Goldberg:
Makes a lot of sense. And then the small ball question, what are the little things that add up to the big things? What are those small singles or bunts that lead to the home runs in your culture?

Angela Hurt:
So I think that our ability to recognize people's talents and recognize people's wins. And one little tiny thing that we do is notes from me to individuals all the time. And it probably doesn't seem like a really big deal, but anniversaries, we don't sell ... We recognize people's birthdays, but we really recognize anniversaries. That comes in a way of a card from me and a giving card. So strangely enough you wouldn't believe how much people love getting a handwritten card from me thanking them. And it's very, very personalized because I know so many people, and a little giving card that they can turn around and give something back to our community.

Angela Hurt:
The other little things that make a difference is we have somebody that's in charge of employee engagement, meaning her entire job is to know what's happening with our people and it's outside of HR and it's outside of their managers. And it creates a way to funnel information to me that I can give personal touches. If somebody's dog dies, they'll get a note from me because we end up finding out about that. And we all know how our little four legged friends are part of our family.

Joel Goldberg:
Yes, absolutely.

Angela Hurt:
And I think that just recognizing those little things in life makes a really, really big difference for our culture.

Joel Goldberg:
That's so interesting too. And the first thought I had was, well boy, if I had somebody reporting back to the CEO on all their little things, that could seem a little bit daunting. Like, "Oh look, big brother's watching." It's the exact opposite, right?

Angela Hurt:
Right.

Joel Goldberg:
You're then coming up with that, that moment where they maybe need that little little bit of extra support or just to know that the founder and CEO has their back has got to go along.

Angela Hurt:
I think what it does is lets them know that I care because I truly care. I mean, this is a fairly big position. I consider it one of the most important positions within our organization. But you have to understand that's also evolved. It's been around for about six years, this role and Hillary, the person in this role has also grown tremendously herself. Because if you can imagine there are people ... She's had to learn what to share with me and what not to share with me. I'm a fixer. I think a lot of us are, right? It's like if there's a problem, I want it solved. And so early in the day she would come back and tell me a lot of things and I would say, "That's ..." I would react. I was a big reactor and let's go fix them. She's like, "No, no, no, no, no. I'm just letting you know they don't want you to do anything about it." And so Hillary in her own way has had to filter being the little in-house psychologist, right?

Joel Goldberg:
Mm-hmm.

Angela Hurt:
Little counselor to people and them venting and talking to her and she's had to really grow and understand what does she share with me and what does she not. What is confidential? Because sometimes people talk to her in a confidential way. And they still feel like they know it's about showing care. And then you have the other part of what are people telling her because they want it to get back to me?

Joel Goldberg:
Right.

Angela Hurt:
It's been an interesting balance.

Joel Goldberg:
Well and there's a lot of trust going on with everyone there, including yourself. You've got to be able to trust Hillary, that she's going to tell you everything you need to know. And that what you don't need to know, you don't need to know, and then you're going to be okay and she needs to be able to trust how you react and they need to be able to trust her and on and on, which then leads to so much of what we've talked about here.

Angela Hurt:
Right.

Rounding the Bases Questions

Joel Goldberg:
All right, four final questions as we round the basis. Actually, I want to start with the caring end. You talk about people all of the time. You told me when I was in that during the government shutdown, you work with a lot of government agencies and certainly some of your team members that you kept on paying them, and that was pretty much out of your pocket. Why was that so important to you, and how difficult was it?

Angela Hurt:
So we've been working within the federal agencies now for about five years, and this was our first real government shutdown. I mean, we've had the one day government shutdown, we've had the threat of a government shutdown, but this was the first time that actually came to fruition. And we had a couple of projects not impacted by it, but we have on one contract alone, a national contract, we have 18 people on that contract, and these are folks who are in a support role that they're concerned about every single paycheck that they have. Not that everybody is but them even more so. And the idea ... Our approach initially was let's take it week by week and see what happens. We didn't know if this is going to last two days. We didn't know if it was going to last two weeks.

Angela Hurt:
And I just came to the conclusion that I didn't feel good about them not getting those paychecks. So initially we have the conversations of, "What can we do for people." So we instantly sent them like what's the bare bones people care about? It's like I need to be able to feed my family. So first thing we did is we just sent Walmart gift cards electronically to every person that worked for us in those agencies to say, "Hey, if nothing else, you have food covered." And as payroll started to roll around, I just talked to the team and I said, "Hey, look, this is something we're going to do." I just, I felt like it wasn't fair to them. I know most people who take a government contracting job knows that the certain time of year, like that's always a threat.

Angela Hurt:
But to me it was something that I felt like we needed to do. We could. I also said, "Hey, one of the great things about not having shareholders and investors that we report to is that I get to make those decisions and if we have a month that looks awful, the only thing that it does is impacts our goals for the year from ... I don't want to say ego only, but ego only, right?" And so I knew we were going to take a hit for a couple of months and it, it was worth it to me. I knew that we'd been conservative in the past and that we had the ability to do it and it was the right thing to do.

Joel Goldberg:
Second question as we round the basis, we'll get to that sports element that we were talking about, and you've been an athlete your whole life. You were telling me that you grew up playing baseball in a male-dominated world. So I want to know what kind of player you are, but also what that taught you then, because you're still in a male-dominated world, less and less maybe every single day, but how much did that teach you as a kid playing with all the boys now being a leader, as a woman, in what is sometimes still a male dominated world?

Angela Hurt:
Yeah, I love this because it's something that I never thought about, and I never thought about it until I was asked this very question, I don't know, let's say 10 years ago. Because I did grow up playing baseball with boys that I kind of felt like I was just ... It wasn't even a weird for me to be doing it. And I felt very much like I belonged on the field and I felt like one of them from that perspective. And so I never really saw the differentiation, which I do think served me well as I got older because I didn't know to feel intimidated or I didn't know that they looked at me differently.

Angela Hurt:
There's certainly been moments, don't get me wrong, but it's something that as I moved into technology and even started my own company, my ability to go out and have happy hours and get certain people to go with me has never been a problem because I was a female, and I've never felt disrespected because I was a female. And it's doesn't mean that I wasn't disrespected as a female, I have no idea. I was just oblivious to it. And I truly think it's just because of my upbringing and what I was around.

Joel Goldberg:
What kind of baseball player were you?

Angela Hurt:
I was a good baseball player.

Joel Goldberg:
Yeah?

Angela Hurt:
Yeah.

Joel Goldberg:
What did you play? What position?

Angela Hurt:
I played shortstop, pitcher and first base.

Joel Goldberg:
All right, all I need to hear is shortstop, and that's generally the best player on the team or one of. That's all we need to know. My third question is also a sports one because this is so unique. I know you played volleyball in college, but I'm more interested in the young woman that was playing rugby as an adult, 20s and 30s, which maybe at this point sounds a little bit tougher. It certainly does to me in my later forties now. I don't think I was playing rugby in my 20s and 30s. I was still playing soccer in my early to mid 20s and that was that. But what was it about rugby that that struck you?

Angela Hurt:
So I didn't know because I didn't know anything about rugby. I was playing pickup basketball at UMKC and a girl came up to me afterwards and said, "Hey, have you ever thought about playing rugby?" And I was like, "Where did that come from? I have no idea the correlation here." And it really was about my ability to move the defense when I didn't have the ball. And so I watched a video of it and I said, "No thank you. I like my teeth." I paid for my own braces as an adult. And I literally had got my braces off two years prior to that and eventually it was like, "Just come out to a practice." And what I loved about it is that I went out to a practice, one of my coworkers, or co-teammates, husband was our coach and I love being part of a team so much that when I got on that field and were being directed by a great leader, I just fell into line.

Angela Hurt:
Crazy enough, one of my favorite things in that first practice is when the coach told us to get to the bottom of the hill, we're going to do hill sprints. And where everybody else moaned and groaned. I'm like, "Oh my God, this is so cool." But doing that and then being brought into my very first match where I had no idea what I was doing and got to score my first try, I was so hooked and I was hooked by the camaraderie. You talk about teammates and people who will do anything for you? I've played all of these different sports, I've never been around something like rugby. I think it's because you're so in it together. You're in battles, you're in these mauls that you're in and pushing the ball forward and it requires everybody to get us there, and we just have each other's back. And I really, really, really love that aspect of rugby. It's unlike anything else.

Joel Goldberg:
Yeah. The only other sport that I've seen like that, and I never played rugby. I really haven't played hockey either. I've been around it my whole life. My son plays hockey and I think it's just that now, maybe the scrums look a little bit different, but there's some of that same physicality. There's also something to be said, I think in rugby and hockey, certainly in the United States, that you're doing something that not a lot of other people do. And, and there's just ... It's that camaraderie that I think makes it unique. And every sport, every team, if it's going well, has camaraderie. That's true here at Veracity, that's true on the volleyball court, basketball court, on and on. There's something a little bit unique about some of those other sport.

Angela Hurt:
Yeah. The other thing is is that your opponents that you're playing every match, like you are out there just beating each other up, and after the game you drink beer with them. And the friends that I have made from the other teams are unlike anything else also. And I think I could pick up the phone if I was going to any city in this country that I could have a free place to stay if I wanted to.

Joel Goldberg:
Well, there's a respect factor. That's what it is.

Angela Hurt:
There is. Yeah.

Joel Goldberg:
I'm not amazed anymore, but I always love showing people in hockey how, certainly at the highest levels, that they'll beat the crap out of each other for two or three hours and then hang out afterwards.

Angela Hurt:
Yeah.

Joel Goldberg:
There's a mutual respect, for the most part, with everyone. Okay. Final question as we round the basis. The walk off question, and I know you've been recognized, and you're involved in a lot of groups, a lot of boards, Kansas City Business Journal women who mean business, one of Kansas City's influential women. So we know that you're a great leader. We know that you're incredibly involved with a lot of people here in this town, and it's been awesome as I've gone through this podcast and met people the last couple of years just to see some of the really good entrepreneurs and leaders here in this town. And I'm seeing more and more women, I don't think enough yet, but I want to focus on technology here as we wrap this up. Where in the world of technology are we seeing women right now? How much is it growing? How much more do we have to go in terms of technology and entrepreneurship?

Angela Hurt:
You know, I think we're seeing a lot more. There's not as many ... I've not seen as many consulting technology consulting, but what I do love is I've seen some phenomenal engineers who have started creating their own platforms. And I think that is the coolest thing. And when you talk about the STEM world, I think that there's so much concentration now around girls and women in STEM that we are putting more education, we're getting people involved earlier. Because that's always the been the big thing was back in the day it was you're going to be a teacher, a nurse or whatever. You don't want to go down this path. This is what boys do. I think that that is changing in the early stages of even elementary school of getting girls involved at a level and not making it a big deal about gender. And so when I see women who are creating tool sets, and they're creating their own technology platforms, it is happening more and more. And I think it's awesome.

Joel Goldberg:
It's becoming the norm.

Angela Hurt:
It is. Yeah.

Joel Goldberg:
Right.

Angela Hurt:
I don't think there's as much of a differentiator as there used to be. Certainly not in the earlier, younger generations. And again, just like anything else, I think that as years go by, I don't think we'll be having the same conversation.

Joel Goldberg:
Yeah, I agree. What is that message you give young girls, younger women?

Angela Hurt:
I use the baseball analogy a lot is that girls truly can do anything that boys can do, and if you have a passion around it, that you go for it and you don't let anything stand in your way.

Joel Goldberg:
Well you've certainly done that, from the young days as a baseball player, through volleyball, rugby, Veracity. How can people get ahold of you or Veracity?

Angela Hurt:
We're at VeracityIT.com is our website. Best way to get to us. We've got a contact form there. Number' is (913) 945-1912

Joel Goldberg:
All right. This is awesome, Angela. I appreciate it. Thanks so much.

Angela Hurt:
Thank you.

Joel Goldberg:
All right, that is Angela Hurt. I'm Joel Goldberg. You can reach me at JoelGoldbergmedia.com, and hope to catch you next time on Rounding The Bases.

---

Rounding the Bases with Joel Goldberg Podcast was created to share the stories of men and women in business and entrepreneurship that are both well knowing and or hidden gems. Joel believes that everyone has a story and their story matters which is why Joel is eager to connect with individuals that are bringing value to their community through innovation, leadership, entrepreneurial journeys, and developing company culture. If you would like to be a guest on Joel's podcast please email us at joel@joelgoldbergmedia.com.