Bob Kendrick: Preserving Baseball’s Untold Stories

No sport inspires storytelling quite like baseball. Every year over the course of a 162-game schedule, stories unfold that are rich in lessons that transcend the game itself. 

With a new season just weeks away it’s easy to get excited about whatever new history will be made in the coming months. But even more important is continuing to honor the history that has already made. 

In my career, I have been fortunate to marry my passions for baseball and storytelling. 

As the pre- and post-game host for the Kansas City Royals, my favorite ones to tell are of MLB debuts. For most, their first big league game is the culmination of a lifelong dream. Those stories always manage to strike an emotional chord in me, and partially inspired my recently-released second book, Small Ball Big Dreams. 

As a speaker, I have the privilege of translating stories from the ballpark into lessons for the boardroom, illustrating the way soft skills like trust, culture and resilience help every team perform better. 

And during a recent episode of my podcast Rounding the Bases, I welcomed a prolific storyteller to the show who has been preserving the legacy of black baseball for 30 years and counting. 

His name is Bob Kendrick, the incomparable president of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. As a longtime civic leader, he has arguably been as influential on the history of America’s pastime as many of the players themselves. 

By bridging the gap between baseball past and present, he continues to build what the late, great Buck O’Neil himself began. Paying homage to legends of a bygone era, and their groundbreaking role shaping the game we know today.

SINGLE: Building a new bridge

The Negro Leagues Baseball Museum was founded in 1990 by pioneering Negro League players, including Buck O’Neil. 

“The Negro Leagues … they built the bridge across the chasm of prejudice,” Kendrick said. “That allowed others to cross over.” 

And now, after 35 years celebrating the history of the Negro Leagues and its players, the museum is at a critical juncture in its own history. 

The Museum is preparing for the monumental undertaking of a new, 30,000 square foot building. It will create space to bring even more stories to life in different ways, while ensuring this cultural - and historic - landmark is preserved for generations to come. 

“If you know the history of baseball, you essentially know the history of this country,” Bob said of his work at the Museum. “We literally changed American history.” 

DOUBLE: Hall of Game

In November 2024, I was honored to co-emcee the Museum’s annual Hall of Game event. 

As I shared the stage with legendary superstars Amos Otis, Willie Wilson, Frank White and Big John Mayberry, the significance of their role in advocating for Negro Leagues history was not lost on me. 

“They’re that first wave of African American  … players who transitioned into baseball,” Kendrick remarked. “The sacrifices that others certainly gave up … they were benefactors of it.” 

As such, players like White and Mayberry were once close with original Negro Leaguers. Now that their predecessors have passed on, they are left with a charge perhaps greater than their fame: keeping the legacy of storytelling alive.

“These are the players who really rode the backs of those who built that bridge,” Bob said, adding, “It really does resonate, and it means something.” 

TRIPLE: The Beauty About Baseball

One of the joys of the work I do is being able to bring audiences into the clubhouse. I love giving them a glimpse of the camaraderie within those walls, and believe there’s something special about watching stories be created in real time. 

It’s hardly unique to modern locker rooms. In fact, I would argue the pranks and energy lend to the unique culture that endears baseball to so many. 

“That’s the beauty about baseball,” Kendrick said. “No matter how old we may be, we’re still just little boys when we’re around this game and the stories.” 

For players like Amos Otis and Willie Wilson who came into their own on the tails of Negro Leagues success, the longevity of those relationships is even more special to witness. 

“They are truly that extension of the Kansas City Monarchs,” Bob shared. “And that was important for … our institution to be able to celebrate them in that spirt.” 

It brings back the fun of being a fan, and has the power to make anyone - even someone like me - giddy with excitement, even if just for a moment.  

HOME RUN: Stories That Live On

Storytelling is central to the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. Of course in the obvious sense, it was created to keep a sacred history alive. But for founder Buck O’Neil, his ability to weave a narrative was second only to his skill on the diamond. 

I never had the opportunity to meet Buck myself. By the time my family moved from St. Louis to Kansas City seventeen years ago, he had passed on. But thanks to his influence on Bob Kendrick’s own storytelling, I often feel as though I knew him my whole life. 

“What I was able to really kind of gain from being around Buck, obviously, the stories he shared,” Bob said. “But even more so, how he was committed to that story.” 

Buck wanted every listener to have the full experience, even if he had told it 1,000 times before. In doing so, he helped people really feel the stories he told…and they created ripples for countless individuals who continue to tell them today. 

“I love seeing reactions to the stories,” Bob shared. “And Joel, I hope long after I hang them up, that these stories still live on.” 

It’s a fitting way to capture the power of storytelling. After all, as Buck O’Neil once said, “Nothing better than baseball. It teaches all he lessons.”

Listen to the full interview here or tune in to Rounding the Bases every Tuesday, available wherever you get your podcasts.

LEARN MORE ABOUT storytelling FROM JOEL 

Book Joel Goldberg for your next corporate event. He draws on over 30 years of experience as a sports broadcaster. In addition, he brings unique perspectives and lessons learned from some of the world’s most successful organizations. Whatever your profession, Joel is the keynote speaker who can help your team achieve a championship state of mind.

FULL TRANSCRIPT

Joel Goldberg 3:36

Hey everybody. Welcome in to another episode of Rounding the Bases presented by Community America Credit Union: Invested In You. A shout out to my friends at Chief of Staff Kansas City, if you're in the market for a job, if you're looking to hire someone, if you're looking for just a great resource, check them out. They're my good friends chiefofstaffkc.com. Making Connections That Matter. One of my favorite connections in Kansas City is my guest today, and I oftentimes say without the actual numbers to back it up, but I'm pretty sure I'm right that no, no person has appeared more frequently on our Royals live pregame show in my 17 years than my guest today, and part of the reason for that is that the players come and go, and coaches and managers and front office, they'll come and go. But this guy is an institution in Kansas City, and truly is a gem, not to mention being a friend as well. So I'm joined by a prolific storyteller, if you've been around, Bob Kendrick. If you know, you know. And he's been preserving the rich legacy of black baseball for 30 years and counting. His name, I think, goes hand in hand with BucK O'Neill because he has become an extension of that legendary figure. Bob is incomparable and impeccably dressed, by the way, as well. I give up now. I don't even try to compete, but the President of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, a longtime civic leader, arguably been as influential on the history of America's pastime in recent years, as many of the players themselves. By bridging the gap between baseball past and present, he continues to build with the late great Buck o' Neal himself began,paying homage to legends of a bygone era and their groundbreaking role shaping the game we know today. And just growing and growing this museum. I always say to people, is one of the most prideful pieces of Kansas City, but really it's a piece of Americana, and I think people are starting to figure that out, locally, nationally and even internationally. So I'm joined right now by Bob, who's dressed down today without any fancy top hat and no, no fancy suit coat. But I was recently over at the museum, and I can never leave there without picking up something from the gift shop. So I've got a brand new Negro Leagues hat, which with this one. What this one represents Bob, but says 1920 on it, and has NLBM on the back and and a really cool Negro Leagues logo on the front.

Bob Kendrick 6:17

Yeah. No, you're styling with it as well. We appreciate, we appreciate you representing man, it's so great to catch up with you. Thank you so much for inviting me to be on the show.

Joel Goldberg 6:28

Well, it's all look. I tell people over and over again that I've you hear this from a lot of people. I've I can complete some of your sentences, and I know where the stories are going. Yet I'm always riveted every single time. And I want to be able to be able to reserve some of this podcast for some of that, that high level storytelling. I want to ask you this before we get into what's going on with the museum. There's so many amazing things going on, and you guys are coming off of a phenomenal year, and I feel like there's always some kind of cool anniversary or or something to celebrate, which is, which is part of you being the great promoter and marketer that you are, and it always helps to have great content, and you do. But how much of your storytelling and you're, you're considered by most, an expert storyteller. And you are. How much of that did you have, you know, coming up as a kid, and how much did you just pull from Buck, having spent so many years being his shadow? How, how much I've always thought that you're I've said this before. I've never, I was never lucky enough to have met him, even though I feel like I know him, and I got here two years after his passing. How I always say you're an extension of Buck. How much of the storytelling did you get from him?

Bob Kendrick 7:38

A lot. A lot. And Joel, I think what I was able to really kind of gain from being around Buck, obviously, the stories that he shared that I now pass along to others, particularly since his passing. But even more so, how he was committed to that story. Because Buck could have told a story 1,000 times, and if he was going to tell you that story and you were hearing it for the very first time, he wasn't going to cheat you. He was going to give you everything that that story brought out of him because he wanted people to feel that. And I think for those who now and and initially, I never fathom myself as a storyteller. You know, you asked where it came from. I'm sure my late mother would say I told stories, but I think the connotation was I was lying. And so I don't know where it came from, but as those who are kind of identified now and having that reputation of being a storyteller, the greatest compliment that we can ever receive is someone saying, I felt like I was there. When you paint a picture and you've worked in radio, you know what that means to be able to paint a picture where people feel like they're there. And to me, there's no greater compliment. And having been around Buck and and a number of other former Negro Leaguers, hearing these stories, embracing these stories, and now getting to share these stories means the world to me and, and I guess I've taken on that same Buck O'Neil spirit. I try not to cheat people when I tell these stories. And it never gets old for me. It just doesn't. So you tell these stories, and I love seeing reaction to the stories. And Joel, I hope long after I hang them up, that these stories still live on.

Joel Goldberg 9:47

Yeah, they, well, that that's that's the goal, especially with so many of these players...I mean, we're getting close to there being none left, right? And

Bob Kendrick 9:57

Exactly

Joel Goldberg 9:58

However the next generation, and we could talk about this later, but you know, you at your Hall of Game Ceremony this, this past winter, fall, winter, November, honored guys that came after the Negro Leaguers, that that were some of the direct recipients to the work and the sacrifice that those Negro Leaguers made. I mean, Amos Otis is certainly closer and in age, to some of those pioneers than then, you know, the more recent players. And so I feel like you have not just in educating the public, but educating those players, where that generation, the Amos Otis's and the Frank Whites and, you know the Dave Winfields and those superstars of the 60s, 70s, 80s, they they understand the history, and I would think are now able to help you be that advocate, right? To continue. Because, because the moment this dries up, it's gone forever, and there's no reason why it has to dry up.

Bob Kendrick 10:59

Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. And those guys that you mentioned, they were extensions of the Negro Leagues. They're that first wave of African American and Hispanic players who transitioned into to baseball. And so we oftentimes talk about it from the standpoint that the Negro Leagues built the bridge, or, as my friend Buck O'Neil would so eloquently say, they built the bridge across the chasm of prejudice that allowed others to cross over that bridge. And so these are the players who really they rode the backs of those who built that bridge. And they understand that. And that was really important, because you could have done this, but not clearly understood how you got there. And the fact that these ball players from that era, they clearly not only understand, but they embrace it. And it really does resonate, and it means something to them that the sacrifices that others certainly gave up gave them, they benefited from it. They were the benefactors of it. And to talk to Dave Winfield, who was in our very first class of Hall of Game Inductees, way back in 2014 I believe it was. And he said there was no greater compliment for him than to sit down with the players from the Negro Leagues and they would tell him, you know, what, son, you were, good enough, you could have played with us. And he understood that that was the ultimate compliment, which is the spirit in which we created the Hall of Game. Because if you were good enough to play in the Negro Leagues, then you're pretty doggone special. And that's what we wanted to convey. And these athletes, you know, we had such a great time with Frank and Willie and Big John Mayberry and Amos Otis. And you know, the conversations were just magical that night. But all of them, every one of them, knew former Negro League players. They were close to them, particularly having played here in Kansas City when there were so many Negro Leaguers still alive here in our city. And of course, sadly, they've all passed on.

Joel Goldberg 13:22

First off, I would say that the that Hall of Fame, that Hall of Game event, was so special because, and this is the world that you live in, and I'm lucky enough now myself that that I, you know, I get to be surrounded by, and it's normal for me to, you know, be surrounded by legends like this, right? If it's part of one of the joys of the jobs that you and I have. Not because it's cool, and, yeah, sure it is, and not because, oh my gosh, it's that you get to be that fly on the wall. To me, Bob, the best part of that event and and I was honored and lucky enough to be able to to co-host, co-emcee that, was not just talking to each one of them individually, but to have those four guys again as an extension to a past era, to have those four guys - Amos Otis, Frank, White, Willie Wilson and Big John Mayberry - to be able to bring to the audience, not just the audience that was there in attendance at The Starlight Theater, but then to your audience on Sirius XM for your Black Diamonds Podcast, to what I feel like is the best part of my job, to bring people into the clubhouse, into the locker room

Bob Kendrick 13:39

Yeah.

Joel Goldberg 13:40

To allow people to be that fly on the wall. They cleaned it up pretty good as as they know how to do. But you got the sense of the camaraderie, of the fun, of the pranks. And if you have, if you have Big John there, I always say, like he's not Rex Hudler, but he is only in the sense that if you just push a button, or you wind that clock up and just sit back and let it go, it goes. How much fun. Like, those moments to me, Bob, where I start to get as giddy as the fans remind me of the joy of being a fan.

Bob Kendrick 15:17

Well, because that's the beauty about baseball. We're always no matter how old we may be, we're still just little boys when we're around this game and the stories. And perhaps because the seasons are so long, 162 games, not counting the postseason, the stories are just so plentiful, you know. And and, of course, the camaraderie that you mentioned between that particular group made it unique for you know, to compare to any other Hall of Game. And we've always had great guests, great honorees, great conversations. But that level of camaraderie, they practically grew up together here playing for the Royals, and it just made it, I think, extra special for me, because they are truly that extension of the Kansas City Monarchs. And that was important for not only me, but for our institution, to be able to celebrate them in that spirit and in that vein. And like, the conversations were just absolutely magical, though they really were.

Joel Goldberg 16:27

Yeah, check out, you know, if you found this podcast, you can find Bob's but, but check out all the episodes of Black Diamonds. But because there's, there's, there's so much more of all this, and you if you weren't, well, even if you were at that event, if you were at that event, you've probably already listened, because it was such a magical night, and that's really what's happened with the museum. Now, the momentum that you guys have, and I want to get into what's coming up this year, and then we got to tell some good old stories still, too, but I want to talk about what's coming up this year, and I'll make a little announcement, which I hope comes as a very small thing, because I don't want to overshadow anything. I've said for many years, as long as there's something going on at the museum, we will, we'll be happy to talk about it on our pre-game shows. And I think I could speak to my broadcast teammates and our crew that that that happens in-game too. And we're lucky enough, whether it be, you know, salute to the Negro Leagues Day or the Jackie Robinson Day, or just if Bob's at the ballpark and we want to do something that I always say, we're more fortunate than any broadcast team in the country because we were here. We're in the same town, which means we have more access to Bob when he's not hopping on a plane to go speak elsewhere or go golfing or, you're always on a plane. But this is home. This is definitely home. But I'm very honored to to to announce that I am joining the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum board, which is as big of an honor as I have had in my professional career. And just get to get to be a small part of something that is truly special and meaningful and going in big places. And so one, I just want to say in front of an audience, how, how excited I am to join the board, Bob. And two, what great timing, because there's a lot going on.

Bob Kendrick 18:12

No, it's a great time, man. We're so thrilled to have you on at this critical juncture for this museum, as we now start to lay the foundation to build a brand new Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. And you know your advocacy and support of this museum has never, ever not been there, but to now have you sitting at the table with us and helping guide this process, because what we're about to do we are going to be involved in leaving a legacy. And I truly believe that this institution is its long term growth and its future is cemented in this next phase of growth. You know, as we now take this bold next step to build a brand new 30 plus 1000 square foot stand alone Negro Leagues Baseball Museum right around the corner from where we operate now. It'll be built adjacent to the former Paseo YMCA, of course, where the Negro Leagues were established February 13, 1920 by Andrew Root Foster. We're converting that historic landmark into the Buck O'Neill Education and Research Center, and the new museum will be essentially adjacent to the historic landmark where it all began. And I couldn't be more excited. It's a daunting task, as you can well imagine. We've got to raise a significant amount of money to make this project happen, but, man, how exciting is it to be here and guide the future of this organization. And so we're thrilled to have you on board, man.

Joel Goldberg 19:52

Well, I'm so excited, and it is a daunting task, because we're talking about millions and millions of dollars. Which is all going to be when it all comes to fruition, it's going to be so beautiful.

Bob Kendrick 20:07

Oh yeah, yeah.

Joel Goldberg 20:09

I'm sure you think about this a lot, this museum that started in what a one room office?

Bob Kendrick 20:16

One room office

Joel Goldberg 20:17

Is already really, really impressive. However, there's, there's no room for movement anymore. I mean, it's like, I don't even know where you guys store half of the stuff that you have, because you are bursting out at the seams too. Give people just paint a little bit of a picture of what the new museum will look like when it ends up being done.

Bob Kendrick 20:39

Well, you know, going through various iterations of what the exterior and interior design will be, but you touched on it. It'll be a far more expansive kind of opportunity for the museum to expound on existing stories, to reimagine those stories, to utilize some of the technology that is now available to us, and finding that right combination of nostalgia and technology creating the additional space. You know, we've been very fortunate over the last three years, the Kansas City Royals have been amazing in terms of making the museum free throughout the month of February. And of course, by the time this airs, we'll be in our fourth year of Free February with our partners over at the Kansas City Royals and The Royals Foundation. Last year, Joel, we drew over 16,000 people in the month of February. You quickly learned that the space was not built to handle that many people. It was very crowded. But you know what? No one complained one bit. They made their way down. And I'm hoping that we'll see similar results this February with our fourth season of Free February. What a tremendous, tremendous community outreach by our friends over at the Royals and the Royals Foundation to make this educational resource available, particularly for school age kids, because there are some public schools who simply cannot afford to take these field trips anymore. And, and this partnership has a lot of that, but you can tell that it just wasn't set up to have a lot of people in it at one time, because we want you to immerse yourself here. It is self guided. We want you to stay in this space as long as you want to stay in this space and absorb this tremendous history. Well, the new facility will give us additional space. It'll give us space to tell new stories, because there are still lots of wonderful stories that we want to include. We want to expand on some of the existing stories. We want to add an interactive baseball experience that will help bring this story to life in a fun, imaginative kind of way. You know, you want to create the ancillary spaces that will allow you to to create what I call non-traditional streams of revenue. So, event spaces and those kinds of things that will be tremendously impactful in helping generate additional revenue to operate this new facility, and it is literally going to change the landscape of historic 18th and Vine. It's going to be transformative.

Joel Goldberg 23:29

Yeah, I can't wait. And again, a lot of work to be done, but, you know, and the technology piece is important too, because kids expect it, you know, they they learn differently than we learned growing up, and we've got to meet them there and and so that's that's part of it, making sure that this museum is able to honor and continue to recognize the past while staying in the present. And of course, every year I mentioned it before, you find ways to to bring people out there, and so many cool, creative ideas you and your team over there. And you know, I feel like, Okay, a couple years ago, it was the celebration of Buck finally, finally going into the Hall of Fame. You know this, this is coming out Free February, right now, by the way, anybody that is listening, Bob and I recorded this in January, but if you're listening, and you've never been to the museum, and you're here in Kansas City, come try it out, and then, and then spend some money at the gift shop, and then come back and bring friends and family later, right? Or

Bob Kendrick 24:31

And Joel, if you, if you're if you've been here, what a great reason to come back again and and support this, because the Royals and the Royals Foundation are paying for it.

Joel Goldberg 24:41

Yeah. And then keep coming back.

Bob Kendrick 24:43

And bring someone with you.

Joel Goldberg 24:45

Yes.

Bob Kendrick 24:46

Yeah. And then, because consider becoming a member of this organization and join our team. Because when you become a member, you essentially become a stakeholder in this institution, and it's one of the greatest forms of support. You know, there are a lot of people when you pledge to say, I am going to join your team and I'm going to send you whatever the amount is, every year, because I believe in what you're doing...that is so tremendously important. And so that our ability to continue to grow from a member standpoint, is also significant as well and so but now we're really excited about the opportunities that are in front of us and coming off the heels of what was one of the most amazing years in recent museum memory. You know, your the challenges each and every year. How do you top that? And so we're going to have to go some to top what happened last year. But I'm excited, and I'm looking forward to the challenge.

Joel Goldberg 25:51

Let's put a wrap on 2024 I mean, there were, there were some monumental moments and developments for not just the museum, but the history of black baseball. And I don't know how you rank them, if that even matters. I mean, I know that that among the many developments last year, the making all of the stats-

Bob Kendrick 26:15

Yes.

Joel Goldberg 26:15

Official and part of the major leagues, to me, might have been the biggest because now any kid that looks this up sees Josh Gibson. I never saw that growing up, so I wasn't learning about Josh Gibson, right? I mean, okay, we all learned about Jackie Robinson, great. But now we're looking and we could see, we could see Josh Gibson side by side with Ty Cobb. A lot of irony in some of these names being side by side too. It was that the, I don't know if that was the biggest development, but I mean, that's a groundbreaking development that'll that'll last forever.

Bob Kendrick 26:50

Yeah, it's monumental, Joel, because we literally changed American history. And as you've heard me say, and I wholeheartedly believe this. If you know the history of baseball, you essentially know the history of this country. They are so closely aligned. Well, the piece that was missing was the Negro Leagues. And through the work of this institution, we've started to kind of bridge that gap that's there in the pages of American history books. But when we look at what took place on May 29 of 2024 when it became official that the statistics of the Negro Leagues were now entered into the record books of Major League Baseball, that was history changing. And I applaud Commissioner Rob Manfred and those involved with this decision to look at the Negro Leagues through this lens, because the Negro Leagues were indeed a major league. They were as major as any league that had already been substantiated and documented in the pages of Major League Baseball's record books. People forget that it's just not the American and National league that's in those record books. You had the Federal League and some of these other leagues that operated during that during a certain time span in American history and baseball history and the Negro Leagues had been...not omitted. They were disregarded. Yeah, because to say omitted that would mean that it was an oversight. It wasn't an oversight. It was blatant disregard. And we knew that this would come with some trepidation from those who just simply refused that those players who didn't play in the Major Leagues, if they didn't play in the Major Leagues, then it didn't happen. And we're here to tell you that it did happen, and it's hard for them to fathom that the players who played in the Negro Leagues were just as good as their major league counterparts, but they were. And we have a couple of posters that I always highlight here. One says just because they weren't in the same league as Babe Ruth and Ty Cobb doesn't mean they weren't in the same league as Babe Ruth and Ty Cobb. And the other says 440 feet is 440 feet no matter what color your skin is. And so the commissioner literally changed the game. He, he literally changed history with what he did, and I was thrilled to be a part of that, working on that committee for almost three years and leaving it up to those historians and researchers to unearth this data. But that was monumental in so many ways. The 100th anniversary of the first World Series was something that we were inherently proud that we brought to the forefront, and even more so home here, here at home, the fact that the Kansas City Monarchs won that World Series, and being able to set the stage for a fun and festive 100th year anniversary celebration throughout 2024. And then, of course, as you know, the epic game that took place at Rickwood Field back in June, where this salute to the Negro Leagues had both national and international exposure. So those three things were just monumental for us in 2024 and they were literally game changing in so many, many ways.

Joel Goldberg 30:25

So those are some of the big moments, monumental moments in 2024. What are some of the big moments in 2025? If this is being released on February 11, we certainly have a what would it be? 105thanniversary coming up in a couple days?

Bob Kendrick 30:44

And you've heard me say this on many occasions, because it's true. You know, everybody who understands how not for profit organizations work will understand the fact that we will make up an anniversary if we think we can raise some money around that anniversary. Now that's what we all do. We'll create an anniversary, man. But you know, these Anniversaries are significant, even more so than just 105th anniversary. It gives us an opportunity to kind of lay the foundation for what this year's celebration is going to be about. Well, this year is a interesting year, not as much from the Negro League standpoint, but the more so that it represents what the spirit of the Negro Leagues were all about. It's the 50th anniversary of Frank Robinson becoming the first African American manager in Major League Baseball history. Well, someone can say, well, what does that got to do with the Negro Leagues? Everything. Because when Root Foster created Negro Leagues in 1920 he didn't just create a league that had all these superstar players in it. You had all these superstar leaders and executives who never got the opportunity. So Frank Robinson becomes the first African American manager, essentially 18 years after Jackie Robinson breaks the color barrier, and you don't get your first African American General Manager till a few years after that with Bill Lucas. And so, yet, instead, you had all of these great baseball minds and great black executives who were operating a complete business structure known as the Negro Leagues, who essentially never got those opportunities. And the fact that there is not a Negro Leagues manager, there's not a manager from the Negro Leagues that is in the National Baseball Hall of Fame is a travesty. And because Buck O'Neil is in the Hall of Fame, and we know that Buck was a great manager, but Buck went in as a contributor. Ruth Foster is in the National Baseball Hall of Fame, but Ruth Foster went in also as a contributor. The fact that there's not a an African American manager from the Negro Leagues in the Hall of Fame is something that we feel we need to take more onus of and elevate greater awareness. So we'll build our year long celebration around what I call leaders and innovators. And so this is going to be an exciting opportunity for us to highlight some of these legendary behind the scene, kind of guys we know a little bit more about, the players and people have become, I think, more accepting of the talent that was there in the Negro Leagues. But you also have to understand that there was great managerial talent, and there were brilliant executives that operated these Negro Leagues, and there are tremendous innovations that came directly out of the Negro Leagues that helped transform our game today. So when we start talking about shin guards and batting helmets and night baseball, please understand that those things emanated from the Negro Leagues. But no one really knows about it. And so we'll spend this year highlighting that aspect of black baseball. But it's all built around the 50th anniversary of a milestone of Frank Robinson becoming the first full time African American manager.

Joel Goldberg 34:14

And let's add into the fact for people that don't know that Frank Robinson is one of the great players of his generation as well. And just looking at the stats here, his first year of pro ball was in 1953. That would be five years, I believe, removed from the Kansas City Monarchslast season. So if he's six, seven years older, he's a Negro Leaguer.

Bob Kendrick 34:41

He's a Negro Leagues player. And trust me, they were trying to sign him to the Negro Leagues, but now he didn't need the Negro Leagues anymore. See that younger ball player, you could bypass the Negro Leagues and go straight into the major leagues, minor league system, or straight into the major leagues. So now the Major Leagues get, say, young Frank Robinson, where otherwise Frank Robinson would have been playing in the Negro Leagues. And you're right, as a player, he won MVP in both leagues. I mean, that's, that's, I mean, that's incredible to even think about. And so he is very much an important figure who was just outside the Negro Leagues, but was mentored by a Negro Leagues player named Bob Thurman, and so he was very much connected. And I'll never forget having him and Frank Robinson here at the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum in 2012 when we were playing host to the All Star game that year, and I had Mr. Aaron, Mr. Robinson, in a conversation on the Field of Legends, moderated by Dave Winfield. And so you had three Hall of Famers, and they're all, you know, they're all in the same fraternity, but they ain't all treated the same. You could tell that Dave was in awe of Frank Robinson and Henry Aaron, even though he's in that same fraternity with them. You know, that's that generational respect, and it was just a riveting conversation. Matter of fact, I think we have that conversation recorded, and so we'll probably share that again at some point, yeah, because both Mr. Robinson and Mr. Aaron's people, you know, when you get to that level, you got people. I don't have people. I'm still working to get people. But their people said, well, you know, they only gonna answer a couple of questions. Joel, I had to cut them off so that we could open the museum back up. You know, the conversation was just going and going and going, and it was just absolutely amazing.

Joel Goldberg 36:46

That's beautiful. And yes, like, you got people. Come on. You know, I usually do biggest home run, biggest swing and miss, and small ball for my guests and and I apologize if you've thought about that, but I feel like I've asked you these before, so I want to do it in a different way. A different way. I just this just occurred to me as we were going, I thought it'd be fun, and this will the home run, will be harder than the swing and miss. The home run, I want to ask you, is, of all the famous ball players that you've met, African American ball players that you've met, is there a moment? I know there are a lot where you had to pinch yourself and say, How in the world did this kid from Georgia end up sitting right here with him? I know you can come up with a list of 100 What's the biggest one?

Bob Kendrick 37:34

Oh, there's no question. I don't even have to think about it. It is walking Henry Aaron through the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. The year is 1999 and the Kansas City Royals had joined Major League Baseball. You know, we were celebrating 25-25 years of Mr. Aaron breaking Babe Ruth's record. And so the Royals, like a number of MLB teams, were having Henry Aaron days at their ballpark. And so the Royals bring Mr. Aaron to town. Buck is out of town, and I get to take my childhood idol and my all time favorite Major League Baseball player on a tour of this museum. And as I often times tell the story Joel, it's the first and only time that I've ever been starstruck. Now, we've had American presidents tour this museum, President Bill Clinton, President George W. Bush, General Colin Powell, former Vice President Al Gore, a plethora of athletes and entertainers. And as I tell you know, Michelle Obama, First Lady Michelle Obama, First Lady Laura Bush, and as I oftentimes say, with no disrespect to any of them, they are not Henry Aaron. In the eyes, mind and heart of this kid from Crawfordville, Georgia, because every day on the playground, I had to be Henry Aaron. Now I know some other kids wanted to be Henry Aaron, but I had to be Henry Aaron, and here I am face to face with my childhood idol. I was at home that day. I'm trying to get everything laid out. I'm laying out multiple outfits. My wife looks at me like, man, what's wrong with you? I'm like, Look, you don't understand. This is Henry Aaron. And so we get to the museum. They get me mic'd up. We've got a throng of media that's following us, as I am taking him on this tour of the museum. And as you know, there's this legendary photograph of him in our Clown Section of the museum, of a young Henry Aaron standing at the train station in Mobile, Alabama. 18 years old. Couldn't have weighed more than 150-60 pounds, soaking wet, frail, looking rather afraid, and he's about to go leave home, likely for the first time, to go join the Indianapolis Clowns of the Negro. The year is 1952 and right by his foot is a small cardboard duffel bag. And so we get to that photograph. He had seen it before, but it been a long time. And he looks at me and he says, Bob, I may have had two changes of clothes in that bag, $1.50 in my pocket, and a ham sandwich that my mama had made me going to go chase that dream, and that was 25 years ago. Last year, of course, we celebrated the 50th anniversary of Mr. Aaron breaking Babe Ruth's record when he hit home run 715 in Atlanta's Fulton County Stadium. I'm at home in my mother's living room in Crawfordville, Georgia, and as my childhood idol is circling the bases in Atlanta's Fulton County Stadium, Joel, I'm circling the bases right alongside him in my mother's living room. Her old couch was first base. She had an old TV that was second base. The other old couch was third base, and her recliner was home plate. And as my childhood idol was touching them all, I'm touching them all too. And I got to share that story with him. And most of us as kids, have sports idols, and in the rarest of opportunities that we get to meet them, they don't always live up to our lofty expectations because we put them on such a pedestal. But man Henry Aaron, far and away, exceeded any expectations that this kid from Crawfordville, Georgia had, and every time I was around him, I was always reduced to that nearly 12 year old kid that circled the bases with him.

Joel Goldberg 41:51

So beautiful and and you never forget it, obviously the swing and a miss. I'll do it this way. I don't know who would be on the list, who, who's the one that got away, who's the star that you never got to, they passed away, and you never like for me, that was actually Aaron and Mays. I never got the chance, and I really wanted to, but who was that for you?

Bob Kendrick 42:15

Well, in terms of getting them to the museum, I spent a lot of time with Bob Gibson, but we never got him to the museum. I really wanted him to experience this, to see his reaction. He was just outside the Negro Leagues as well. As a matter of fact, Buck tried to sign him to the Monarchs, but he goes to Creighton instead to go play basketball. And people may forget that Bob Gibson was an outstanding basketball player who played for the Harlem Globetrotters before he embarks on his Major League Baseball career, becoming one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball history, of course, with the St. Louis Cardinals. But we were never able to get him to Kansas City to experience the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, and that will always be a regret of mine, that we couldn't make that happen. Because he was just right up the road in Omaha, but we could just never get it to happen. And so I know that, like every other athlete who comes into this museum, he would have been humbled by his predecessors and what they were able to do to afford him that opportunity to play there in the major leagues.

Joel Goldberg 43:28

I could tell you this. I'm just looking it up, because the time period is almost identical. I was just curious how Bob Gibson did against Frank Robinson, and looks like 98, 98 played appearances, 83 at bats. Looks like Frank hit .229, against him. But, but he had a .726 ops, he had was .304, looks like he had maybe four homers against him, and so, yeah, that's probably pretty good numbers, by the way, against Bob Gibson.

Bob Kendrick 44:06

Yeah, absolutely. I had some young ball players here from the University of Kansas, their baseball team, they came down to tour the museum, and I don't even know what led us down the path of talking about Bob Gibson, but one of the young guys asked something, and I referenced his ridiculous 1968 season, where he posted for the season a 1.12 era.

Joel Goldberg 44:33

Yeah.

Bob Kendrick 44:33

I mean, it's hard to even fathom. And of course, Joel, as you know, the very next year, they lowered the mound. Yeah, they lowered the mound because he was so dominant that year. And somehow or another, he lost, I don't know, 7, 8, 9, 10 games that season. He won 27, I think, but he he lost a bunch of games that year. You question, How in the world did somebody beat him? Because the Cardinals didn't score very many runs. And I think his shortage, shortest outing that season was seven innings.

Joel Goldberg 45:07

Wow. His shortest. Well he batted, I have it here. He batted .229, Frank Robinson against Bob Gibson. He got three doubles, four homers. He did have 19 RBI in his 19 hit. So when he hit him, he was able to get him, but

Bob Kendrick 45:26

But you know, everybody has the same stories about Gibby, how intimidating he was. When we inducted the great base steeler Maury Wheels into the Hall of Game, and he says, the first time he faced Bob Gibson, he got a signal off of him. And Gibson's looking at him all the way over to first base, I mean, just staring at him. And of course, Maury had already established his reputation of having great speed and a base dealer. And so Maury takes this big lead. And he says, Bob just starts cussing him just, I mean, just cussing him out. And and he looks at the first man. He said, man, what's wrong with him? He said, Young man, you might want to shorten your lead. If not, there are going to be some consequences and repercussions that you might have to deal with.

Joel Goldberg 46:22

Yeah, you don't want to mess with that. By the way, the just, just, this is fun stuff for me to look at the the most home runs. We got some big names here. Most home runs ever hit against Bob Gibson was 10 by Billy Williams. And second was Hank Aaron with eight.

Bob Kendrick 46:42

Yeah.

Joel Goldberg 46:43

So.

Bob Kendrick 46:43

Yeah. That's the baker said he had a, I don't know, 17-18 game hitting Street, going first time he faced Bob Gibson, and he told Henry, said, Look now when you go to the plate, don't dig in. Don't look at him. Do not look, do not look at it. He said, Well, what am I supposed to do? He said that 17-18, game Street came to an end that night. History came to an end that night.

Joel Goldberg 47:13

Let's do, let's do small ball, and we'll do it in this way. The little things that lead to big results. To me that, you know, and I in, in my first book, second one's just out, but my first books Small Ball Big Results, there was a chapter on the Negro Leagues and and really, to me, the the those Negro League ball players represented small ball, not on, not just on the field, but off the field. Because they had to do everything to survive. They had to do everything to get it right. And they did it with so much energy and passion for for the game, for life, for each other, for their communities. Tell me about small ball, what it represents, maybe in bigger terms for, for those Negro League ball players that that paid a sacrifice and did so for the most part, without thinking twice about it, they just did it.

Bob Kendrick 47:59

Because it wasn't a lot of fanfare. Now, granted Joel, they were stars within their own community, sure. But mainstream America is over the last maybe two decades, have really started to understand the significance that the Negro Leagues represented, both on and off the field, and each year we get a little bit closer and a little bit closer to elevating that platform to where it is becoming more commonly recognized around the significance of the Negro Leagues, and that's the important role that this museum plays. And we want to keep chipping away at this. We're going to keep chipping away, chipping away some of the things that we highlighted earlier in this session, the things that happened last year are significant along that line, what we've done with the inclusion of the Negro Leagues in the video game MLB The Show, and the third iteration of that game is set to come out late February, early March, with at least eight new players introduced in the game. All these things are having meaningful impact as we continue the down the road to really elevating the awareness, hopefully generating greater interest, and in the process, greater support for the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum as the primary caretaker of this incredible history.

Joel Goldberg 49:29

Four follow-up questions as we round the basis. Along those lines, um, as special of a year as it was that included as every year does some very tough deaths, right? And every, every, every death is tough. I mean, to lose Willie Mays, well, arguably the greatest player in the history of baseball, so that that's tough, just like the loss of any life. But then to lose Ricky Henderson

Bob Kendrick 49:58

Yes

Joel Goldberg 49:58

Arguably the, the most dynamic player of his generation, and to lose him at such a young age, a couple days before his Christmas birthday, while still looking like he could play and probably could at 64-65 years old, I'm just curious. I mean, obviously devastating. You knew both of those men, and you were very close to the Willie Mays situation, as that happened, too. But the just curious about the place the museum has here, and certainly the Hall of Fame and all that too, to be able to do your part, to be able to, I think that those, those Negro League ball players, they you really have to preserve their history because they're not household names, perhaps like a Henderson or or a Mays or an Aaron. Yet I know that the museum plays a critical part in that, and I'm curious what that means to be able to help preserve some of that legacy.

Bob Kendrick 50:56

Well, and you're right. Those were very difficult losses for me personally, as well as for this institution, particularly when you lose a Willie Mays. You know, as you've heard me say before, there are certain people who just aren't supposed to die. Buck O'Neal was never supposed to die Willie Mays, I think for all of us who are baseball fans, he was never going to die, even though we know that no one's going to live forever. But if anyone was, it was going to be Buck O'Neill. It was going to be to stay a kid. And so his loss was tremendous, but you touched on something. You know, Willie was in his 90s, and while you hate to lose a player the magnitude of Willie Mays, it wasn't surprising. Ricky Henderson's death was a total surprise, and it caught us all off guard, and I think that made it made that pill that much more difficult to swallow. I'm very proud that we were able to get him to Kansas City for him to experience the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, because he represents everything that is, that spirit and signature style of the Negro Leagues. You know everything about the way Ricky Henderson played the game speaks of what it was like to play in the Negro Leagues, and for him to come here and be completely humbled, because the persona that he had, you know, was always about Ricky. But when he walked inside this space, it wasn't about Ricky anymore. It was about this piece of history that maybe he knew surface level, but until he went through this place, didn't have the full scale and scope of what this history really meant. And it was just a again, another special time for me and the museum. And you know, my heart goes out to his wife, Pamela, his family, the legion of fans who loved him. He is by far the most dominant leadoff hitter this sport has ever seen. And people try to get me to compare someone to Ricky Henderson and Negro Leagues, and I can't come up with anybody. You know, that's how that's how trailblazing Ricky Henderson was, that combination of speed and power in the leadoff position, which is something that we had not seen before.

Joel Goldberg 53:41

And by the way, anybody that makes it to the big leagues and throws left and hits right will never have the numbers of him, because there's like, one or two of those ever, every year.

Bob Kendrick 53:57

Exactly.

Joel Goldberg 53:58

It's always the opposite, right? So I always whenever, whenever you see that rare player that that throws left handed and hits from the right side, I always say, oh, that's, well, they're not going to be Ricky Henderson, but that's everything about him is unique. And I was lucky enough about five years ago to interview him in Oakland, and he could not have been more gracious and nice. And so it's one, it was one of the highlights of my career to be able to experience, to be able to experience one of the guys that I loved watching as a kid that was in a class of his own. Our second question as we round the bases, for anyone that that sees video of this, you know, my backdrop has a lot of bobble heads. There's a, there's a monarchs pennant, there's a Buck number 220, uh number 22 pennant. There are a couple Buck bobble heads up there, but, but I think what stands out behind me the most is whatever you call them, fat heads, or one of those Big Satchel. And I, I thought I had a Buck one. I don't know what happened to it, but this one seems appropriate, because who should be looming more large than Satchel Paige. Among the many, many, many, many great stories and nicknames and all that. There's then Satchel. What, what? Why? Why does he stand above the rest? Or, or does in my mind, there any guys? There's no one else like, natural.

Bob Kendrick 55:14

Yeah, there's no doubt in my mind, he is the GOAT. He is the greatest pitcher of all time, and, and, and I say that Joel, because even as we look at it from the Negro Leagues, you hear people say, Well, you know, such as I threw just as hard as Satchel. You know, such and such stuff was just as good as Satchel. But when you are the measuring stick that everybody is comparing to, you must be pretty doggone special. And while there were a lot of great pitchers, always has been, always will be a lot of great pitchers, there'll only be one Satchel Paige. And we talk about it from the standpoint of combining longevity, you know, the fact that we don't know how old he really was, and how many years he pitched and pitched effectively throughout those unfathomable numbers of years that he pitched as a power pitcher in this game, the great stuff, some 55 no hitters, and only God knows how many strikeouts and the charisma. So when you talk about combining all of those elements, you don't get but one Satchel Paige. He had the entire package. He was must see, because when he rode into the towns, the town shut down. Completely shut down to watch the old man do his thing. So that's must see TV there, man. And, so yeah, you have a lot of guys who have maybe one or two of those. You'll find many that got all three, and Stachel had it all.

Speaker 1 56:23

All right. Third question as we round the base is, I always say my favorite nickname was Cool Papa Bell, but there's so many. That's the beauty among the many beauties of that generation of players, they all seem to have a nickname. Do you have a favorite? 1,2,3, nicknames from back then?

Bob Kendrick 57:10

Well, I don't think you can talk Cool Papa. I think Cool Papa is the greatest nickname in baseball history, and it fit him to a tee, because cool was cool, that he really was. And it's just one of the greatest nicknames of all time. But now, if you played in the Ne- in the Negro Leagues, you had to have a great nickname, or you probably couldn't play. And so you've got nicknames like Boo Jude Wilson. Jud "Boo Jude" Wilson, and he got the nickname Boo Jude because of the sound of his line drives off the wall. Which would go boojude.

And they nicknamed him Boo Jude. You know, that's always been one, one of, one of my favorites, and of course, the great Martin de HIGO, whose nickname was El Mastro. The master. Because he could do it all. Played all nine positions. Played all nine of them. Well, the only baseball player in the history of our sport to be enshrined into five different countries Baseball Halls of Fame. The Mexican, Cuban, Venezuelan, Dominican and in Cooperstown. So El Maestro is one of the great ones, and there were so many, many more. I love Willie Wells, whose nickname was El Diablo, the devil, because he could dig it out of the dirt. One of the great shortstops of all time, national baseball, Hall of Famer, yeah, Willie El Diablo Wells.

Joel Goldberg 58:54

My other favorite is Double Duty Radcliffe.

Bob Kendrick 58:56

Of course, of course, that that ranks up at the very top of the list too. Ted Double Duty Radcliffe. And folks, he earned his nickname Double Duty when the great sports writer Damon Runyon saw Duty catch the first game of a doubleheader. As a matter of fact, Satchel was on the mound. Take off the pitching, take off the catcher's gear, take the mound and threw a set out in the second game of the double header. And they said he was worth the price of two admissions, and he was nicknamed Double Duty. He died at age 103 in 2005 in Chicago and wherever Duty is right now, somewhere in that great somewhere, you can rest assured, he is talking and telling plenty of stories.

Joel Goldberg 59:53

I love it. Okay. Last one the walk off question. You know, sometimes I find myself going towards, well, how do we get more kids? Kids in the city playing and all that. No, we're not going to solve that today. It does need to be solved. Still, we need to get back to a generation of the Winfields and the Hendersons and where, everywhere you look, teams were, were, were, you know, all star teams worth of black ball players, because they they were the best. And now those kids aren't going out, but they're still some of the best players in the game are still, to this day, African American, just not, not as many. Who's, who's the guy right now? I mean, I've got a name in mind, who I think is the greatest representative at this moment of black baseball. There's not a wrong answer. I'm just curious who, who you look at first and foremost.

Bob Kendrick 1:00:38

Well, if we're talking about former players, current, current players, current players. You know, it's hard to go you can't go wrong with the way Mookie Bets plays.

Joel Goldberg 1:00:49

That's my guy.

Bob Kendrick 1:00:51

Yeah, Mookie. Mookie is, is everything that makes baseball good. He's that little guy that plays so much bigger than what he is, what his physical stature, which is why baseball is the greatest game ever invented, because your physical stature doesn't dictate whether you can play this game. You can be five-five weigh 125 pounds and still play baseball, or you can be six-seven and weigh 280 pounds, like Aaron Judge and still play baseball, because he's on the other end of the spectrum. And both of them represent this game, I think, extraordinarily well. And we've been so fortunate to have both of them come and visit the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, Mookie on multiple occasions, and Aaron finally made his way here last season when the Yankees were in town. And so, yeah, no, it's exciting to see these guys and the way they play the game, and, you know, to see some other young ball players involved in the game now, and hopefully we'll continue to see that growth as it relates to American born blacks playing playing this game. And there's a pipeline coming up through the minor leagues that I think are going to have a tremendous impact on this game.

Joel Goldberg 1:02:15

Mookie is it for me. I just, you know he, he's an All American kid. I mean, he's, he's, he's everyone you would want to introduce to your family. He is, he is the guy that plays the game right, plays the game hard. He'll cut your throat if he needs to. I mean, it's not, it's not that he's just a nice guy. He's the full package. There's a guy that could play center field, second base, shortstop. He's doing it in the big market, in the place where Jackie Robinson, once, you know, once paved the way. I mean, he, to me, is everything that you want in a leader, white, black, Asian, whatever it is.

Bob Kendrick 1:02:47

Absolutely.

Joel Goldberg 1:02:48

And I can't think of a better representative. So that's, that's where my mind went. I was just curious. There are still some unbelievable influences in this game. And glad to hear that the pipeline is growing and coming up. Bob, so excited for 2025 pitchers and catchers reporting any opening days around the corner. And can't wait for a phenomenal 2025 for the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum.

Bob Kendrick 1:03:13

Yo Joel, thank you so much, man. It's always fun to catch up, and we're all looking for another exciting season of Royals baseball and, and certainly, what we hope will be a fun and festive and productive season for the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum as well.

Joel Goldberg 1:03:30

Appreciate it as always. I'll talk to you soon.

Bob Kendrick 1:03:32

Looking forward to it, man. Thank you.

Joel Goldberg 1:03:33

Thanks, Bob.